Sometimes Honesty Is Actually an Insult

Here’s the scenario:

Person A goes out with Person B. At the end of the night, Person A tells Person B that they’re just looking for something casual and would like to have sex with Person B.

What people need to realize is that saying “I just want sex” is not honest, it’s lazy.  Seduction requires effort and motivation.  They’re putting NO effort into it.  That implies that they simply don’t care about the outcome.  That “honesty” is also counterproductive so you could even deduce that they WANT the person to say no and is looking – consciously or unconsciously – for a way out. I’m more sexually aggressive with women when I don’t care about the outcome.  That often ironically results in “success” because some women are turned on by the confidence.    Then, when a woman comes along that you like, you tiptoe around her and she thinks you’re a weakling douche.  Law of nature, I think.  You can totally understand it and still not be able to do anything about it. – Stu

Is this kind of honesty refreshing..or is it insulting?

Your Thoughts?

 

Sometimes We’re Just an Option

So here’s the scenario:

A woman goes on three dates with a man. She has sex with him on the 3rd date. The holidays come around and he goes quiet for a while. She decided to give him the benefit of the doubt and believe him when he said they’d get together after the holidays. So the holidays end and they go out again. (It’s not clear to me how this date came about and who contacted whom first. When info like that is left out of the story, I’m always a little suspicious. But suffice to say they went out again. The day after their 4th date she sent the guy a text saying she had a good time and how it was nice to see him. He never replied and she never heard from him again.

The woman clears up a few points:

The “contacting over the holidays” was mutual but limited, i.e. she sent him a text that didn’t require a response, days go by, he sends her one that says his phone has been dead, she responds. Days go by, texts sent again – but only very few and no conversation was initiated on either part because they were both busy.

As for his intentions: it was quite clear they were both very interested in the beginning. He definitely pursued her, contacted her, discussed how much he liked her. Then disappeared. I think that’s the point: the dudes that show clear signals of interest, do the contacting, etc, so you feel like you’re on the same page. I agree that having a conversation is probably a good thing, but they also met online – which inofitself allows the assumption that you’re looking for a relationship.

My question is this: Where are these “clear” signs of interest? If she had to initiate the text exchanges over the holidays and if he was taking days to respond to her texts, how is that a “clear sign of interest?” To me, that’s a sign that the guy is moderately, if that, interested. Which is sort of typical for those early stages of dating, no? You’re speaking as though when all men do this – initiate contact, express interest – that they should somehow be held to that for an indefinite amount of time. What’s that saying about a woman’s right to change her mind?

As for how meeting someone online allows someone to assume that the person they’re dating is looking for a relationship…that’s a pretty slippery slope. Online dating also “allows” one to assume that the person they met is who they say they are…and how often does that not happen? Especially now. Maybe it’s me, but I assume that any guy I meet online ISN’T looking for a relationship until he tells me he is.

This is a scenario that, I think, constantly get misconstrued. I don’t think the guy’s lack of response had anything to do with the fact that she expressed her interest. I think he had to do with the fact that, from the beginning, she was just an option. And a man is allowed to decide for himself whether he wishes to pursue said option or not. Could he have been playing a game? Absolutely. But I think it’s really dangerous for women to assume that any time this happens, a man is “playing a game.” Sometimes they are. Other times they’re just making a decision that is right for them. Just like we do.

It seems like men get villianized unfairly for this. While I don’t like the fact that he fell off the face of the earth after he slept with her and find it disrespectful, the whole men/conflict thing has been beaten to a bloody stump around these parts. Everybody is allowed to decide whether or not they wish to pursue something with someone. Everybody is allowed to date with their own motivations or agendas. Where they become bad people is when they’re disingenuous about said intentions. Meaning they lie. If your friend made it clear what she was looking for upfront, before she slept with him, and he said he was seeking the same thing and really liked her and that he saw a future with her beyond a few dates, well he’s a not so nice person. But if that conversation never occurred, then the woman in this scenario proceeded at her own risk.  Here’s a good rule of thumb: If you question whether a man’s intentions are sincere, it’s best to proceed slowly. Either something about their behavior is tripping your internal triggers OR you’re carrying with you remnants of disappointments past and you won’t be able to give the guy a fair shake.

Sometimes it’s not that men are scared off by hearing or experiencing a woman expressing interest. Sometimes, believe it or not, they’re showing mercy by disappearing. Once a woman states her intentions, a man with a conscience is quite likely to pull back. If a man knows he’ll never be able to return her interest/courtesy/honesty on a comparable or respectful level, he can’t in good conscience proceed. The goal is to do this before he does too much to encourage the woman to believe otherwise. There is thing as a good man in a bad situation. What keeps him a decent man is that he sees the potential for hurt feelings and removes himself from the situation, instead of stringing you along for his own amusement. It’s actually smart for a woman to tell a man that she’s enjoying getting to know him. It will weed out a lot (but not all) of the men who aren’t on the same page.

If someone is interested in you, taking the initiative is not going to throw things in to chaos. Could he have been scared off by her revelation? Only if he wasn’t interested in getting to know her better and was just looking for sex. Or if he had been juggling options, she was just one of them, and he chose someone else. This whole “they’re a game player” thing is kind of overwrought in my opinion. If a woman can pursue just sex, or can require time to “figure out how she feels”  before she has sex, so can a man. Sure, men might not need time to determine if they’re ready for sex. But they do need time to determine if they wish to pursue something on an ongoing basis.

Sometimes I think the real hurdle for women is that they find it hard to believe that men have their own set of needs and their own comfort zones. Men don’t want to waste their time, either. And while they might not have  a problem with having sex with someone they’re unsure about, they do not want to become obligated to someone that they do not truly enjoy and with whom they feel comfortable.

There was another blog post recently where the woman went out on two dates with a guy, but decided by date 2 that he wasn’t relationship material. So she decided to have sex with him because, while she didn’t see him as Mr. Right, he fit the bill for Mr. Right Now. Perfectly acceptable. Four or Five days later after their 2nd date (and the sex) he sent her a text asking her where she’d been and what she was up to the next night (Friday.) She said she had plans early in the night, she said, but would be around after 8:30. He never responded. She wondered what was up and why he disappeared. Well, he was treating her as an option. Just like she had treated him like an option by deciding he wasn’t relationship material. We females are not the only ones who can do that, you know 🙂

I don’t think the man in the original scenario was playing a game or scared off by how the woman told him she enjoyed his company. I think he just wasn’t all that interested in the first place.  He rode it out, so to speak, and made a decision. He just didn’t tell your friend. Does that make him a bad person? Well, he’s not the most polite or courteous, that’s for sure. But again, the blow off or Fade Out is not exclusive to men. Men and women use that approach.

The real inconsistency here is how common it is for women to argue their right to take similar approaches to dating that they believe men take. Yet when that gets turned around on them, they’re thrown off their game and revert to behavior that is more commonly attributed to women – over analyzing, over thinking and assuming that games are being played.

Figuring out if you’re interested is not playing a game. That’s an integral part of the dating process.

 

One Step Forwards, Two Steps Back – She Wants to Go Back To Not Having Sex

Hi Moxie,

Wondering what you and your readers will have to say about this. I’ve had 3 dates with a woman. On the 2nd date we had sex. A couple of weeks later (she was out of town for a week) she said she wanted to go back to not having sex. She’s a great girl and the last time we saw each other (our 3rd date) we didn’t have sex. I went over to her place to watch a movie. The conversation about sex came up and she said something like, “I don’t want this to just be about sex.” I said, “I completely understand, but want you to know it’s not.” Time went by and we almost started messing around and she said, “I don’t want this to lead to sex tonight” and it completely killed the mood. When the conversation came up I reminded her that I’ve tried to do things outside of my apartment and hers, but schedule conflicts seem to prevent that from happening thus far.

I was trying to be very cool about the situation and said something about hanging out the next day. She then said, “Well, I won’t know until later tomorrow.” As we continued talking I said, “You have to understand where I’m coming from. You canceled plans last night, and here I am trying to make plans with you (outside of our apartments) and you’re asking me to keep my schedule open for that day… with no clue if you are going to be free or not.”

The situation was rather frustrating. She’s not a shady girl at all, but I don’t think she understood how things were coming off. Also, I asked her to a movie last night, and she’s the one that suggested I come to her place.

We talked for a bit longer, but I eventually ended up leaving shortly after. I tried to explain that boundaries like that are very limiting and seem problematic from a chemistry standpoint.

In my mind I thought she would have been game since we hadn’t seen each other in a week or so… but it most certainly didn’t feel that way. – Greg, 34, Boston

She’s not a shady girl at all,

That’s your first mistake.

She is shady. Shady meaning either she’s unaware of why she’s doing what she’s doing (which will lead to a looooot of disagreements) or she’s well aware of what she’s doing and being manipulative. You’re seeing what you want to see and over looking big, giant red flags.  You’re torn. You want to give her the benefit of the doubt. But something inside you won’t let you fully commit to that intention. LISTEN TO THAT VOICE!! If you tell her you’re not just in it for sex, and she trusts you, then why not just have sex? If she can take you at your word, then why the hesitancy? Here’s why: she either doesn’t believe you (and good luck convincing her) or..she just likes watching you squirm.

Sorry, but nobody over the age of 25 should invite someone over to their apartment unless they plan on having sex. Period. She’s doing the whole “omigod , I’m not that kind of girl who screws guys on the second date.” Honey, we’re all that type of girl at some time or another. I’d say 80% of men, when their date has sex with them on the first or second date, are so relieved at the lack of game playing that they can’t be bothered to wonder with how many other men you’ve done this. If the man likes you, the sex isn’t going to change that. Where these types of men get concerned, as DMN once mentioned recently, is if the woman acts too detached or too casual about sex or talks about sex in a way that devalues or objectifies her lovers.( This is why so many dating bloggers find themselves on the receiving end of The Fade more times than they can count, BTW. If you write about your dates/lovers as plot devices or props instead of people, you can expect guys to not call you back.)

She’s testing you to see if you’re genuinely interested in her. She’s making you jump through hoops so you can prove to her that you really like her and not just interested in having sex with her.

It won’t stop here. It will be an endless series of tests. People who behave this way always end up being way too much work.

This woman is not emotionally healthy. People whose behavior is inconsistent like this – that’s a warning that something is off. These sorts of people – men and women – can do a lot of damage if you don’t take control of the situation right away.

If you want to continue seeing her, you have to make it clear to her that you feel this taking two steps back thing isn’t a productive move. Not because you want to have sex but because you feel it’s manipulative. You have to stand your ground here. She honestly might not even be aware that she’s doing it. If you point it out to her and say that your intentions are honest, hopefully she’ll feel more comfortable. But if that roller coaster starts again and you feel like she’s picking fights (bad sign!!!) then you have to grab your balls and leave. You will not change her. She might never change. You’re not about to play Henry Higgins.

When Can a Booty Call Work?

Name: kinlah | | Location: Islip , New York |Question: When does a booty call get old?  I have been seeing this guy on and off for the past five years, and although this relationship is very convenient, it also is getting kind of old.  He is now 49 and when we first met it was amazing, now time is kind of playing against him. Plus I want more in a relationship, more than the relationship can ask for.  And although the only option right now is to leave, I seem to keep going back. So at this point I question whether I am attached to the man. Or using him as a way to not pursue a real relationship?  |Age: 32

If you want more, and you know this guy can’t give it to you, then you have to make a concerted effort to find someone who can. That is, if you really want such a relationship. If you keep going back to this guy and aren’t actively trying to meet available men, then I question of you really do want something “more.” So you’re first step is really figure out what it is you want, and what you can handle. Because you can have one of these relationships in your life and want to find a mate. It just takes some compartmentalization in your head. You have to be able to turn off any thoughts off this other guy. You have to be able to pretend that this man does not exist in your life save for the times you and he get together. What you do with this man should not factor in to how you interact with other men. If you can’t do that, then get out now.

Let’s approach this from a different angle:

How do you know when you’re getting too attached to or using a casual relationship as some sort of placebo or excuse for not engaging in a real relationship?

Well, here are some ways you can tell: (Note: You can be attached to the situation, and not necessarily the man or woman you’re sleeping with.)

1. You know you’re getting too attached (or got too attached too quickly) when your mood is dependant on whether or not you see or hear from your lover.

2. You over-analyze everything they say

3. You question the validity of their reasons for why they can’t get together

4. You get hurt when they tell you that, at the end of the day, they are moderately interested at best, have met someone, have a date, etc.

I’m someone who, dependent on where I’m at in my head, can take a huge hit to my self-esteem by getting involved in these situations. When I do, at least now, I know that the fact that I am doing it means something is off with me. And instead of pursuing these arrangements, I should go to an ashram somewhere and meditate on why I feel I need that.

The worst time to take part in these NSA/Casual whosidoos is when you’re already vulnerable. Like you’re fresh off a break up, or feeling not good enough, or had a string of rejection in the form of Match.com dates. This is why I urge people to take a mini-break if they have gone on more than 2 unsuccessful first dates from any online dating service in a six-week period. Take. A. Break. Regroup. Do something that makes you feel good about yourself or at least happy. Consistent rejection or disappointment just is not good for the psyche, ladies and gentleman.

What’s an ideal casual/NSA arrangement? How do I find someone who isn’t going to treat me like gum on the bottom of their shoe?

Well,  here’s the kicker. Nobody can make you feel anything. So the first thing to do is  plug-in to yourself and make sure you’re truly comfortable and confident enough to engage in this situation. If you feel like gum on the bottom of someone’s shoe, regardless of how your lover treats you, you’re going to perceive things in a certain way and assume they are treating poorly.

As for how to shop for someone who would make a fun, yet respectful, casual sex partner? I don’t think there is any way to know who is going to show you courtesy and be honest and who isn’t. That’s what makes these situations so messy.

I was having a similar conversation with Tad, a man I’ve known for about 8 1/2 years. We were talking about how neither of us (well, let’s face it, me) have ever gotten attached to our on again/off again “arrangement.”  The key, I think, is that he never  we genuinely got along and had things in common. We also kept conversations and interactions limited and contained. While sometimes we’d meet out for drinks, for the most part he’d come over, we’d hang, we’d have a couple of drinks and then do our thing. He’d stay for a little while. Then leave. I always knew what I was getting and where I stood. But that didn’t happen the first few times we hung out. We had to establish a baseline with each other to gauge what was each other’s normal. Once we did that, it was smooth sailing. We developed a genuine friendship over time, which tends to help avoid the gum on the bottom of the shoe stuff. There was a point where I felt I was relying too heavily on him, and I had to cut him out. I was starting to question him, and that’s a bad sign, as these situations really don’t have much room for that. Time went by when we didn’t speak. Then we got back in touch again, and things have been even better only because we’ve become real friends without (much) sex. We’ve hung out plenty of times where there has been no physicality. So, while I don’t know if booty calls can lead to real relationships, I do believe they can blossom in to genuine friendships. But if you think or feel or hope that this person you’re casually sleeping with “could” be something more? Don’t do it. Meaning…don’t engage in a casual situation. Either tell them upfront how you feel and see if there’s promise or avoid, avoid, avoid.

Will casual sex interfere with my desire to have a real relationship?

I think that depends. It is very easy to become dependent on these situations. Especially if you truly want an emotionally intimate relationship. When that’s what you desire, then it’s hard to keep those feelings locked up or dormant. It’s highly likely, if finding a substantive and committed relationship is your main goal, that all those feelings and desires and longing is going to be projected on whomever you decide to temporarily share your bed. Where I think it really becomes an issue is when you engage in these situations in an ongoing fashion. If this is what you accept time and time again, and you’re going on dates and out meeting new people, and you’re always finding something wrong with the person or just not “in to it” (note I didn’t say “them”) then that’s a really good sign that you’re using these situations as a way to avoid real intimacy. You can get too dependent on these people who take up this fluid space in your life. It all depends on where you’re at emotionally and mentally. When you find yourself getting complacent about dating or going out, you have to fight that urge to just sit home and send a booty text. Go out, even if it’s for an hour or so, just to keep yourself in the head space of someone emotionally available.

 

Best of Moxie – Blue Balled

Originally Posted April 20, 2009 – 58 Comments

Name: John  | Location: Queens , NY |Question: So I’ve been dating this girl for a little over 2  months…. so far no sex. The first few dates we went back to my apartment and did everything up to sex, both of our clothes were off but got cut off at the end. She said she “is not there yet with me”. For the next 3 weeks  we hung out twice a week- no real hooking up, just a little kissing. She told me at one point that we didnt talk enough on the phone (she was a little upset) which was my fault so we ended up talking every day or 2 (she calls me and I call her) and still going out to dinner/drinks twice a week. So fast forward to last night, I asked her where our relationship is going? We go out and talk and have a good time but there’s nothing physical. She said that she understands my situation and needs but is “not there with me yet” and needs to know me better before doing that. She’s not a virgin or anything so its not like shes waiting for a ring. After that conversation I almost feel like my balls were just taken away and now I feel like I’m on the fence here which is a shame because I was crazy about her at first. My thought process now is she’s not comfortable enough with me after 2 months this is never gonna work. Thoughts? |Age: 30

And you’d be right. Move on. This girl needs an extra level of attention and affirmation and that speaks to how she will behave and act in the future. She’s going to be in need of constant validation.

I know I should join Team Vagina on this one and implore you to be patient, but you’ve been patient. I I’m not saying she should be putting out after date three. Of course a woman should be allowed to wait until she’s comfortable. But it’s been two months. If she’s not comfortable now, after all the dates and phone calls, then she’s never going to be ready. She’s trading attention from you for heavy petting from her. That’s not how it’s supposed to work. This is literally a tit for tat arrangement.

You’re calling her more because you think it will get you laid. Not because you genuinely want to call her. What person wants to get attention that isn’t genuine and comes with an ulterior motive?  You’re not calling her enough so she’s keeping everything buttoned up. But then you give in to this need and suddenly it boobie time! That’s childish. And, to be honest, it kind of makes you look like a door mat.

ETA JAN 2011: There’s a great saying that a lot of women use to describe men who don’t push for sex. “Oh..he’s such a gentleman!” No…he’s just not a date rapist. He could also be a gentleman, but the two can be mutually exclusive. This idea of what a gentleman is or isn’t hasn’t me baffled. Especially when I feel like there’s this test out there that women like to use that involves nothing that would actually tell you how much of a “gentleman” a man is. Like how often he pays, how much he pays and what he tolerates and puts up with.  More often than not, all that stuff is somewhat of an act. Men know what many women use to measure their value, so they play up those aspects. Half the time, the guy you know on dates 1-5 is not the guy you’re dating 5 months later. You don’t get authentic behavior from a subject that knows he/she is being monitored and rated. I think women do a huge disservice to themselves by equating how long a man will wait for sex with how much he likes her. I’d say 8 times out of 10, when a man hears “I need to feel comfortable with a man or have exclusivity before I have sex” from a woman he’s dating, he thinks she’s playing games and he bails. And in those cases, it is in no way fair to assume the guy was just looking for sex. Sure, probably 3 of those 8 were just looking for sex. But if he endures more than 3 dates with you and then loses interest when things don’t progress physically, there’s a really good chance he did like you, did want more and was tired of what he perceived were childish games.

Bottom line is that we all know within the first couple dates if we’re interested in taking things further. Yes, sometimes it doesn’t happen on the first date, but it should and usually does kick in after date number 3 or 4. If after two months she’s not sure, then that’s a sign that she’s either just not interested, has major issues surround sex and commitment, or just stringing you along.

I really used to think that if it was the right guy and he was truly interested, he’d wait for as long as it took. Uh uh. That’s not the case anymore. Each man has his own personal window for how long he’ll go without getting laid. The longer they go without it, the quicker they lose interest.  They’re tired of putting in time on a woman with little to no ROI. Yes, that means time, emotional and financial investment.

Let me be clear. I’m not encouraging women to have sex before they feel comfortable. But I am advocating that women be a bit more self-aware and honest with themselves and the guys they date. Two months and she’s “not there yet?” There’s something wrong there. Which is her responsibility, not his.

 

Got a dating related question? Want free advice from Moxie and dozens of other national and international singles? Ask Away. It’s Free! Look for Moxie’s response and feedback from others SUBMIT YOUR DATING ADVICE QUESTIONS HERE: http://moxieinthecity.net/ask-email.php

Should The Word Promiscuous Be Banished?

OK, I’ll admit it. I see red when I see the words “spread your legs,” “keep your thighs shut” or anything of that nature. It’s an unnecessarily graphic and crude visual, it implies that women alone have a gatekeeper function when it comes to sex (that a woman’s legs or thighs are the only thing preventing a guy from having his way sexually, and consent has no role), and it reinforces the golden vagina syndrome (the women who spread their legs easily are the ones failing to sufficiently guard their precious treasure.) Also, I don’t see nearly as much use of “stop whipping your dick out,” or “keep it in your pants, and a number of women use it to refer to other women in a way they would never demean men. Think what you want about women who have — or don’t have — casual sex. But try to be a bit more respectful when it comes to your contempt for their bodies, ok? – Paula

Paula, women *have* had a gatekeeper role in sex for like, a thousand generations, we’ve had the Pill for only 50 years. You can demand that people’s expectations change all you want, you can’t make it so. Life’s not fair. Despite best intentions, we all will subconsciously judge a promiscuous woman negatively. – Joey G.

Actually, Joey, it’s really only the last 50 years that women have had a gatekeeper role — before that, they were either considered property of their husband, or forced to submit to arranged marriages, where you legally couldn’t be raped by your husband.It was actually an advancement that women had enough control over their sexuality to play any sort of role over it. But we’re not going to reach true equality until both women and men have the ability to exert control over their own sexuality, where it’s not one gender’s primary responsibility.I’d love to be persuasive enough to change how people think, but right now, I’d settle to change the language they use. If it remains in their thoughts, there’s not much I can do about it.And please speak for yourself — I don’t judge a promiscuous woman negatively, and would love to banish that word from the lexicon. It’s also mostly applied to women: when’s the last time you heard “promiscuous man?” He’s usually called a stud, and we use “manwhore” to distinguish him from the whore default, which is a woman, of course.I’m much more likely to negatively judge someone who hypocritically tries to hide their own sexual desires and/or sexual activity while judging everyone else’s. But I pretty much feel that way about all hypocrites. – Paula

 

Thoughts?

 

 

 

Exclusivity & Sex – Mutually Exclusive or Not?

Here’s a question:

Do you require or prefer that you be in an exclusive, committed relationship before you have sex?

If this is your preference, have you found that this approach works or doesn’t?

if this request has been presented to you, how do you react and respond?

Best Of Moxie – Where Did This Pressure To Put Out Come From?

Originally Posted Oct 4, 2009 – 37 Comments

Stupid and counter-productive behavior. All of the successful relationships I’ve had started with sex on the first few dates; the other women I’ve dated either never put out or did so so late that I’d already lost interest and mentally moved on to someone else. – Crotch Rocket, on women holding off on sex because she thinks the guy wants a relationship and not casual hookup.

This dude has plenty of time for dating and will have a girlfriend as soon as he finds what he wants. The “having too much on my plate” line was a nice way of letting Alissa down easy. I’ve used it many times myself. Here’s the translation: “I am very much available to start something new – just not with you”. – Craig

I have to say that, at 40, I feel more pressure to put out on a first or second date than I ever did in my twenties or even thirties. Is it that the older guys get the less willing they are to wait and see if there’s possible compatibility? Are they just tired of the whole courting/getting to know you stuff? What is it?

I’ve had a handful of first dates in the past few months where I’ve been asked back to a guy’s apartment or had a guy request to come upstairs to my place. Some were online dates, others were with men I met out at events. In each situation, the date itself went well. Conversation was easy, there was a mention of another date, there appeared to be mutual chemistry. Then I would politely decline any invitation to take things back to one of our apartments. Sometimes I’d get the “I’ll call you” line, sometimes I wouldn’t. I’d say 80% of the time I wouldn’t hear from the guy again. (NOTE: If he doesn’t make plans for a second date or at least say he’ll call you, you won’t be hearing from him again. He’s saying that without saying it.)

Yes, some guys just ask women out with the hopes of getting laid. I get that. But I’m hearing about these kinds of dates more and more often. They can’t ALL be False Pretense dates. This never happened as frequently when I was in my early to mid thirties. It’s only been in the last couple years that I’ve noticed this.

I don’t get it. I really don’t. What are we supposed to do? Just give it up and go with it and hope the guy isn’t lying to get what he wants?

Why do I get this feeling that we’re being punished for not putting out?

As for Craig’s comment, may I ask a simple question? If you’re not interested in anything, or don’t feel the woman measures up to her profile pic or whatever…..is it really so difficult to just say good bye, godspeed, best of luck? Why do you have to act like you’re interested? I know, I know. You figure why not make the best of it/get my money’s worth/etc. I get it. But do you see how that kind incongruous behavior might be the very reason why we’re hesitant to just “go with it?”

ETA DECEMBER 2010 – Something I learned this year was the importance of establishing a baseline with someone before getting in too deep. I need to determine, at least somewhat, what someone’s or “normal” behavior is. That way I don’t read in to their behavior intentions that are not there.  One thing that will always set off my alarms is if a man’s behavior changes the minute we sleep together. Often times, it means something is off. But many times it means nothing. Since we don’t know the other person’s routine and rituals yet, we don’t know that. We assume something is wrong. Then we get in our heads and start over analyzing. And we all know what happens we we head down that path.

Best of Moxie – For Men, Monogamy & Commitment Are About The Timing

Originally Posted Oct 1, 2009 – 41 Comments

so right before 1st date sex (right as the condom is going on), this guy disclosed to my friend that hewasnt interested in a relationship. of course it killed the moment and they ended up talking instead. however, a few hours later they still did the deed. she continues to see this guy for sexy time but it is always precursed by the “false pretense date”(dinner, dancing, day trips). so it is total fake romance, just to get both of them in the mood. because how can sex be fun without romance for either male/female? i think men need romance to get it on too and that’s why they pull the false pretense dates.- yb

Let’s not romanticize what’s really going on here. Men don’t need romance to get an erection or to have no strings sex. What this guy is doing is playing the role of the boyfriend, but with one caveat.

He won’t give the woman exclusivity.

He’s Caveat Dating. He wants the companionship and attention and affection and even the emotional connection that comes with a relationship…but he doesn’t want the obligation or commitment. A man will act like your boyfriend, call you, see you every weekend, take you to brunch on Saturdays or Sundays…but when you ask him where things are going or whether or not you are exclusive, he’ll say he’s not looking for a relationship. That’s a lie. He IS looking for a relationship. He’s just not looking for a girlfriend. Caveat Relationships can go on for months because a lot of women presume exclusivity. I mean, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it’s a duck, right?

Wrong.

You are only exclusive when the two of you explicitly state that you are exclusive. Guys will avoid this conversation for as long as they can because, even if they don’t have any designs on anyone else or have any other options, they like the idea of being free to do what they choose. That’s why they are happy to take their time and drag things out for as long as possible. They’ll keep the woman happy long enough for him to get comfortable with the idea of being in a committed relationship. Or until he meets someone that he does want a relationship with. Usually what a man means when he says “I don’t want a relationship”  is “I don’t want a relationship with you.” He just leaves the “with you” part off because he likes the companionship and sex and doesn’t want to lose it.

Name: fast&furious | Location: Boston , MA |Question: Recently, I went away for one week to a group event with friends. Towards the end of the week, I connect with a guy who I have seen in my circle of friends. The last two days of the trip spent 24/7 with him. The attraction was instant, so we became intimate right away. After returning from our trip, we hung out everyday, 10 days straight. He instantly broke up with his girlfriend to be with me.Their relationship was coming to a close when we meet. Its been about six week since we met and the intensity is still the same, even thinking of going away for thanksgiving. Should I be concerned that everything is going quickly? He says I am his girlfriend. |Age: 40

If it seems too good to be true or seems too easy, it usually is.

The guy you’re speaking about is looking to get out of a relationship, and using you to do it. He’s convinced himself it’s that he’s swooning in love with you, and I’m sure to some degree he does care for you and like you. But he’s been staying in a dead end relationship for awhile now…so why leave now? Oh, that’s right. Because before he let go of one branch, he needed to find another to keep him from falling. It’s the timing that’s right for him, not necessarily the relationship itself. I’d slow things down if I were you before you get crushed.

I am cynical about high speed, broadband relationships.  Even more so when I hear about relationships that go from dating to engaged to married to getting pregnant in under two years. In my opinion, any man who moves this quickly does so for one reason..his biological clock was ticking.I don’t care how great a woman is or how ideal she might be….men spend their whole lives avoiding monogamy and commitment. I mean, they give in and do it, but we’re talking the end all, be all of monogamy – marriage. No guy is jumping in to that just because he thinks he met his dream woman. In fact, I don’t think the woman has nearly as much to do with it as his desire to start a family. I think when a man decides it’s time to have kids, it’s amazing how quickly he’ll find Ms. Right.

What’s “right” is the timing… for him. Same goes for the man in this letter. He was looking for an excuse to finally leave his GF, and this woman provided it. So he’ll tell himself, in order to avoid feeling like a jerk, that it was just fate or love at first sight or things with this relationship were just “right.” That’s why he finally put his girlfriend out of her misery. Yes, that’s it.  No, he’s not selfish for maintaining a relationship with his GF when he knew things were bad or on its last legs. No, not at all. (sarcasm)