Resolutions & Revolutions

With Dec 31 being both NYE and my birthday, I’m working on my list of resolutions. I’m also making note of new dating trends that are become more prevalent.

Starting with this:

ETA DECEMBER 2010 – I think we’re moving away from traditional dating and relationship in many ways and various reasons. Something else that plays a part in this change is that many people are consciously deciding or choosing to be single. Not everyone feels a need to pair of and has no problem providing for themselves whatever emotional support that they need. I think there are more and more people choosing this route, and not because they’re burnt out or bitter or have given up, but because they are self-sufficient and feel very comfortable being on their own. They’re single by choice and don’t feel a need to defend that. They date if they choose to, but don’t date with the goal of settling down. They date for the fun and companionship and, sure, the sex. They aren’t following some time line or being ruled by a biological clock. They have what they need because they’ve provided those things for themselves. They don’t date because they need to or feel they should. They date because they want to. And if they don’t want to, they don’t. I honestly believe now that there is a growing segment of the population – comprised of both men and women – that are choosing to stay single. I don’t know what’s behind the choice, or if it even matters why they choose to be single, but I don’t think it’s as simple as “Single” or “Married” anymore. I think there’s Single and Dating, Single by Choice and Coupled up now, with each “category” having it’s own variation.

I used to say that I didn’t believe anybody would choose to be single. My perspective has greatly changed in the past year. I think this is a growing segment of the single population now. The question I have is…why? What was the impetus to this shift?

As for resolutions, I wanted to throw these out there.

Stop being obsessed with being single-Between defending your single status to talking about what it means to be single or how being single affects your life, I’m kind of “singled out.”  When it’s all you can think about and talk about, it ends up defining you. And limiting you. You run the risk of never being able to identify or think any other way. For real. If your goal is to find a relationship, keep thinking like a single person and obsessing about how others perceive you and you’ll do nothing but get in your own way.

Stop making excuses and exit plans – If you’re constantly finding some reason to be wary of a person or avoid going on a date, don’t bother. All of those reasons and prejudices and “concerns” are just phony excuses. Either get past them or drop the charade and admit you just like saying you have someone who wants to take you on a date. You’re wasting everyone’s time.

Stop with the rules and point/value system – If he calls and asks me out he’s really interested. If he really liked me he’d do this. If she really cared she’d do that. What you consider important or “right” or appropriate isn’t always what someone else considers appropriate. Let go of it. Please. If there’s one thing you take away from these posts, it’s that.

Take a freakin’ risk – You went out on a couple dates and you were pretty sure they were interested. So what happened? I don’t know…why don’t you contact them and ask them out? If they accept just to be polite or hoping to get laid, trust me, you’ll know. Sure, you might waste a couple hours, a few bucks or some great lipstick. Or you might meet that person you’ve been waiting for. Only way to find out is if you jump.What are you waiting for? JUMP!

Stop fearing rejection/Stop being so damn stubborn – Listen, it happens to the best of us. You might get turned down, or they might disappoint you. It happens. But this is life. You can’t avoid any of that unless you hole yourself up in your apartment and never leave it. Who cares who makes the first move as long as someone makes it. If you click with someone, you’ll look back and breathe a sigh of relief that you didn’t run away.

Stop getting stuck on the small stuff – It’s not worth it, you know. By focusing on the minute details you’re missing out! The emailing and the texting and the type of dates they choose or things they say in their emails. By no means should you go against your gut. But you have to learn how to determine when you’re truly afraid for your safety or being played and when you’re just plain scared. Stop being scared. Stop letting that fear rule you. You’re limiting yourself…and you’re missing out on all those small moments that, when mushed together, create one hell of an experience.  Start trusting your feelings again.

Stop blaming yourself – We all fuck up. Every one of us. Yep, you zigged when you shoulda zagged. Instead of beating yourself up and being angry at yourself for it, embrace it and learn from it and let it go. That last part is crucial. It’s not enough to say “Oh I have a bad habit of…” Acknowledge and fix it. You can. I know you can.

Choose to be happy with who you are in this moment – Forget about improving yourself for someone else. If you choose to improve, do it for you. But before you do that, find your happy place. Somewhere you go in your mind that fills you with both joy and passion. Work from that place.

For 2011, rebrand yourself. Come up with a whole new you. A whole new plan. A fresh outlook. It doesn’t even have to involve meeting someone. Focus inward, take some inventory, make the changes. Decide who you are and what you want. Then go for it. Fearlessly. As my Dad always says, you are capable of anything if you put your mind to it. Someone recently gave me some great advice. Step in to your power. Become that person you’ve always wanted to be. And toast yourself if you’re already there.

What I want for all of you is to be happy right where you are. Single by Choice, Single and Dating, Coupled Up..whatever. You make a contribution without even knowing it. You don’t need a partner to do that.

May 2011 bring you everything you desire, everything you seek and so much, much more.

Hot or Not: Is It Ever Equal?

Start dating men who find you hot. You know, old school style, like when you were in your twenties. I don’t mean, “sure I’d hit it.” I mean, “Damn I have to have that woman” hot. Do that, you don’t have to think about who asks out whom, who pays, when to have sex, etc.. it all sorts itself out without your having to think about it. Seriously, give it a try. The only downside is, you have to be honest with yourself about which guys out there actually find you hot…hint: they aren’t the ones you’ve been dating.It’s dating with an eye towards suitability that does not work for women in their late 30s to 40s. Men in their 40s aren’t dating with suitability as a goal yet — they are still all about physical attraction. That’s why they are happy to go younger. Indeed you are right about how “progressively successful dates” don’t work. They don’t think that way (but they do know we women often DO think that way, and so playing along is an easy method to a piece of ass.) – Vox

Hot is subjective and so are the cadre of men over 40 yrs old. Stereotypes are only perpetuated by those that lean on them as an excuse. Enough already. Being over 30 is not a dating death sentence. What I have come to find from reading every single dating propoganda site and self help book is that it does not matter how “hot” you are..stylish, popular, if your attitude sucks and you are self absorbed and bitter no relationship will last. I would go on record to say every time I have met a man of significance that I have had a relationship with I was dressed down and approachable. – AmyRose

“Hot” is subjective. Whoever you are, whatever you look like, someone finds you hot.If you think that being hot = being self-absorbed and popular, you need a self-esteem check. If 10 men look at my picture, 1 will think I am hideous, 1 will think I am hot, and most are going to think I am “ok” or “good enough” which puts me right as average. I go for the one who finds me hot.I suggest you date those people who find YOU hot because dates are smooth sailing when you do. OR you can keep dating guys who think you are ok, agonize over whether they like you, worry about splitting the check, keep performing on every date and HOPE that someday they will fall in love with you. That’s what the average letter-writer does and it isn’t working, is it? – Vox

Why do so many women get angry at the idea of letting physical attraction work for them? It’s the way things have been done since the beginning of time. It makes dating a snap, if you are willing to accept the reality of which men truly find you attractive. I suspect therein lies the rub… wanting what you can’t have. – Vox

Okay. This brings up an interesting discussion. We’re probably all heard that sage piece of advice about  finding someone who loves you more than you love them, right? I don’t know how I feel about that. We’d all like to think that we will and can find someone that we love and who loves us equally. But people and human behavior being what it is, is that really even possible?

Now, Vox’s point also makes me curious. Go for someone that finds you hot. Sounds reasonable. But would that mean that you should find them “hot,” as well? Vox, you don’t mention if the woman is supposed to find the man equally attractive or not.  If so…is that really a bad strategy? Or is it suggesting that we- men and women – should just settle for someone that worships us so there is less of a chance they’ll leave us?

There’s something kind of defeatist about that. I mean, I don’t think being hot has any bearing on whether or not someone will stay faithful or interested. We’ve seen countless men cheat on their stunning wives and girlfriends. I don’t think being “hot” guarantees anything in the long run.

Best of Moxie – Why Can’t She Get a 3rd Date?

Originally posted Aug, 2010 – 42 comments

Name: NYCgal | Location: NYC , NY |Question: Hi Moxie, For the past 4 years Ive been dating men  that I either meet online or out at bars, etc.  After lots of dating experiences Ive made all sorts of mistakes, sleeping with the guy after the first date and then expecting a relationship, getting attached way too quickly, acting insecure or pushy after a few weeks into the romance, etc. ect.  Theres also been times when I just loose interest in the guy after a few dates and decide to stop dating them.

Ive been out with a few new guys in the past few weeks.  2 guys and another guy that I met online and who called me 3 times the last week and a half and asked me out for an afternoon date this Saturday.  1 of the guys from last week seemed pretty into me and said we should plan to go out again early next week (meaning this week) I said I would like that and to call me to plan something.  I havent heard from him which is ok.  Even though it is a story that repeats itself so Im not at all surprised, I would like to know why do guys do that?  The guy even asked me if he could get a kiss at the end of the date and I said yes.  I gave him a peck on the lips and that was it.

Then the other guy, which I liked the most, we went out last Tuesday.  Same thing, peck on the lips as I was leaving.  He walked me to the subway.  Then he texted me that night to say he had a great time and that we should do it again. I texted him back the next day saying I did too and that I would like that.  He texted me 2 days later asking me if I was free Friday after work for another drink.  Dinner on a real first date would be more appropriate but hes european and I thought maybe dating is different there, plus it was right after work.

Anyway, we went out and had a great time and kissed, pretty intensely this time.  He walked me to my subway again and he said we should go out again next week.  I had told him my weekend was totally busy and had some things already scheduled the first few days of the week except Monday.  But I said yes we should go out again.  He texted me on Sunday to ask me how I was doing and to tell me he saw a movie I recommended and that he liked it.  It was just a few texts and he sent the last text.  Its Tuesday and I havent heard from him.  I dont plan on contacting him.

Really Im just wondering why do guys do this?  Wasnt that the right moment to ask me out if he wanted to?  And if he doesnt contact me again, what happened?  This has happened to me before, so my real question is, what could be the reason (what should I do differently??) Im not moving onto the 3rd or 4th date when the guy seemed so interested (ie. asking for a kiss, saying he wants to go out again and picking a place, texting?)?  Would love to hear the mens perspective on this.

Thanks! |Age: 31

If I’m following this correctly, the guy you went out with last Friday not only a) asked you out again but b) followed up with you on Sunday and sent you the last text. So then, he sent the last text and you never replied? Or..what? So now you’ve got your heels firmly dug in to the ground and you’re waiting for him to follow up AGAIN?

Let me give you a peek in to his mind. He suggests you get together again. You tell him how full your calendar is except for Monday. He sends you a text that same night after the date saying he had fun. You reply the next day. He contacts you a few days later via text, you don’t respond to the last text. (To be fair, we have no idea what the conversation was, if he was just saying Goodbye, whether his last message warranted a response.)

He’s thinking you’re not interested. That’s the first possibility. The second is that he’s a man and he’s online dating. Which means he has options. He doesn’t have to wait around to see if you’re going to warm up to him. He can find someone who is more responsive or that tickles his fancy more pretty easily. Obviously, someone shouldn’t tolerate rude or bad behavior. But this idea that a man should put on a kicky song and dance just so a woman can feel special and important to him is bullshit. Unless the attraction is mutually intense, most men aren’t even hugely invested until they’ve slept with a woman. Up until then, you’re just someone he likes that he hangs out with occasionally.

Dinner on a real first date would be more appropriate but hes european and I thought maybe dating is different there, plus it was right after work.

That’s not really your call.

You do yourself such a disservice by thinking a man should follow a certain set of steps or rules or should prove himself to you. While you’re sitting there keeping score and judging his choices, he’s online chatting with a woman who has no problem meeting him for a second date at the local dive bar for $3 pints. He’s not really concerned if he’s hitting all his marks with you. Nor should he have to be. If this is how you really think, don’t kid yourself in to believing that men aren’t picking up on it.

From the sounds of it, it wouldn’t hurt if you were a tad  more responsive. It’s okay to show that you’re interested. In fact, it’s pretty crucial. I know so many men who are completely oblivious to the fact that a woman is flirting with them or interested in them. Sometimes you really need to make the extra effort and just say outright how you’re looking forward to seeing him again. You also need to show appreciation. Take the initiative and follow up with a thank you text. Don’t sit back and expect him to prove to you his level of interest after two dates.

Most men look for a woman who meets them half way, starting on the first date.

Best Of Moxie – Where Did This Pressure To Put Out Come From?

Originally Posted Oct 4, 2009 – 37 Comments

Stupid and counter-productive behavior. All of the successful relationships I’ve had started with sex on the first few dates; the other women I’ve dated either never put out or did so so late that I’d already lost interest and mentally moved on to someone else. – Crotch Rocket, on women holding off on sex because she thinks the guy wants a relationship and not casual hookup.

This dude has plenty of time for dating and will have a girlfriend as soon as he finds what he wants. The “having too much on my plate” line was a nice way of letting Alissa down easy. I’ve used it many times myself. Here’s the translation: “I am very much available to start something new – just not with you”. – Craig

I have to say that, at 40, I feel more pressure to put out on a first or second date than I ever did in my twenties or even thirties. Is it that the older guys get the less willing they are to wait and see if there’s possible compatibility? Are they just tired of the whole courting/getting to know you stuff? What is it?

I’ve had a handful of first dates in the past few months where I’ve been asked back to a guy’s apartment or had a guy request to come upstairs to my place. Some were online dates, others were with men I met out at events. In each situation, the date itself went well. Conversation was easy, there was a mention of another date, there appeared to be mutual chemistry. Then I would politely decline any invitation to take things back to one of our apartments. Sometimes I’d get the “I’ll call you” line, sometimes I wouldn’t. I’d say 80% of the time I wouldn’t hear from the guy again. (NOTE: If he doesn’t make plans for a second date or at least say he’ll call you, you won’t be hearing from him again. He’s saying that without saying it.)

Yes, some guys just ask women out with the hopes of getting laid. I get that. But I’m hearing about these kinds of dates more and more often. They can’t ALL be False Pretense dates. This never happened as frequently when I was in my early to mid thirties. It’s only been in the last couple years that I’ve noticed this.

I don’t get it. I really don’t. What are we supposed to do? Just give it up and go with it and hope the guy isn’t lying to get what he wants?

Why do I get this feeling that we’re being punished for not putting out?

As for Craig’s comment, may I ask a simple question? If you’re not interested in anything, or don’t feel the woman measures up to her profile pic or whatever…..is it really so difficult to just say good bye, godspeed, best of luck? Why do you have to act like you’re interested? I know, I know. You figure why not make the best of it/get my money’s worth/etc. I get it. But do you see how that kind incongruous behavior might be the very reason why we’re hesitant to just “go with it?”

ETA DECEMBER 2010 – Something I learned this year was the importance of establishing a baseline with someone before getting in too deep. I need to determine, at least somewhat, what someone’s or “normal” behavior is. That way I don’t read in to their behavior intentions that are not there.  One thing that will always set off my alarms is if a man’s behavior changes the minute we sleep together. Often times, it means something is off. But many times it means nothing. Since we don’t know the other person’s routine and rituals yet, we don’t know that. We assume something is wrong. Then we get in our heads and start over analyzing. And we all know what happens we we head down that path.

Best of Moxie – Is Dating Dead?

Originally Posted Sep. 1, 2010 – 55 Comments

I’m trying to “date” using an online service to see if the people in my age bracket who use it are  interested in “dating,” or just interested in the other things under a different and less honest name. But my theory that no one actually dates any more (as in the traditional definition of spending time with a relative stranger to get to know them well enough to determine whether to advance to a relationship) has not yet been disproven, either through my own experience or that of those around me. Even what my manwhore friend S calls “dates” are essentially what he goes through to get to sleep with someone, not because he wants to find someone for a relationship. – Paula

This is an interesting thought. I think there’s some truth in this statement.

I do agree that there seems to be two types of situations that are more often discussed or prevalent. Either a man or woman is constantly going on a bunch of first dates that led nowhere. Or they’re engaging in these civilized casual sex arrangements. Dates seem to consist of meeting for drinks as a pre-tense to sex. Anyone who says they prefer something more involved (NOT more expensive) is told they’re entitled or spoiled. Sorry, but I happen to agree with Themis’s comment about not being down with the drink and fuck scenario so many men are fond of. It’s just sheer laziness.  But they wouldn’t keep doing it if there weren’t plenty of women who accept such minimal effort. So you can’t get frustrated at one side and not the other. If you’re genuinely looking for a relationship, the only way to combat this is to set higher standards for yourself. That goes for both men and women.

I happen to believe that there are plenty of men out there who are excited at the possibility of getting to know a woman and incorporating her in to her life. But, for whatever reason, they aren’t being given a chance. I also think that many women are being held responsible for the mistakes of girlfriends/wives past, thereby causing them to be dismissed. More than anything,  many of us are falling prey to the “bigger, better thing” mentality where we think someone “better” is just a click, poke or Tweet away. What you have is a bunch of people bouncing off each other on their way to another ball instead of standing still and connecting. And that’s the problem. We have so many ways to connect or re-connect with people…yet we’re not actually connecting. I think we’re all so worried that we’re missing out on something, or being played, or feeling trapped that we’re afraid to stay on the ride and see where it takes us.

Personally I blame online dating for greatly, but not solely, contributing to this mentality. No where else will you find such a high concentration of people who have their priorities out of whack and a distorted perception of themselves. That internet serves as a nice little barrier where everyone can pretend to be someone they aren’t. Then, when they’re confronted with actually having to be themselves, they run in other direction. The internet is fraught with opportunities to build a false sense of intimacy. In the light of day, when we have nothing to use as a shield, we’re afraid people won’t like the “real” us, the person behind the status updates or profile. If online dating taught me one thing it’s that nothing is more unsettling to those who rely on their well-crafted image than to realize how totally transparent they are.

Back to the original topic. Is dating dead? If so, what’s the cause of death?

Are women afraid to speak up because they think they’re too easily replaceable thanks to the Intrawebs? Are men’s brains so filled with stories about how their friend got screwed in a divorce that they have no desire to commit? Are we, as a society, being groomed to believe that commitment no longer means anything?

I do believe that there are many, many people out there who are willing to devote themselves – in various compatible capacities  be it open relationships to living in separate homes to traditional marriage – to someone else. If you’re constantly exposing yourself  to people who don’t believe in these things, or who are either incapable or disinterested in reaching such levels of intimacy, then that eventually will wear off on you.

ETA DECEMBER 2010 – I think we’re moving away from traditional dating and relationship in many ways and various reasons. Something else that plays a part in this change is that many people are consciously deciding or choosing to be single. Not everyone feels a need to pair of and has no problem providing for themselves whatever emotional support that they need. I think there are more and more people choosing this route, and not because they’re burnt out or bitter or have given up, but because they are self-sufficient and feel very comfortable being on their own. They’re single by choice and don’t feel a need to defend that. They date if they choose to, but don’t date with the goal of settling down. They date for the fun and companionship and, sure, the sex. They aren’t following some time line or being ruled by a biological clock. They have what they need because they’ve provided those things for themselves. They don’t date because they need to or feel they should. They date because they want to. And if they don’t want to, they don’t.

 

 

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Best of Moxie – For Men, Monogamy & Commitment Are About The Timing

Originally Posted Oct 1, 2009 – 41 Comments

so right before 1st date sex (right as the condom is going on), this guy disclosed to my friend that hewasnt interested in a relationship. of course it killed the moment and they ended up talking instead. however, a few hours later they still did the deed. she continues to see this guy for sexy time but it is always precursed by the “false pretense date”(dinner, dancing, day trips). so it is total fake romance, just to get both of them in the mood. because how can sex be fun without romance for either male/female? i think men need romance to get it on too and that’s why they pull the false pretense dates.- yb

Let’s not romanticize what’s really going on here. Men don’t need romance to get an erection or to have no strings sex. What this guy is doing is playing the role of the boyfriend, but with one caveat.

He won’t give the woman exclusivity.

He’s Caveat Dating. He wants the companionship and attention and affection and even the emotional connection that comes with a relationship…but he doesn’t want the obligation or commitment. A man will act like your boyfriend, call you, see you every weekend, take you to brunch on Saturdays or Sundays…but when you ask him where things are going or whether or not you are exclusive, he’ll say he’s not looking for a relationship. That’s a lie. He IS looking for a relationship. He’s just not looking for a girlfriend. Caveat Relationships can go on for months because a lot of women presume exclusivity. I mean, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it’s a duck, right?

Wrong.

You are only exclusive when the two of you explicitly state that you are exclusive. Guys will avoid this conversation for as long as they can because, even if they don’t have any designs on anyone else or have any other options, they like the idea of being free to do what they choose. That’s why they are happy to take their time and drag things out for as long as possible. They’ll keep the woman happy long enough for him to get comfortable with the idea of being in a committed relationship. Or until he meets someone that he does want a relationship with. Usually what a man means when he says “I don’t want a relationship”  is “I don’t want a relationship with you.” He just leaves the “with you” part off because he likes the companionship and sex and doesn’t want to lose it.

Name: fast&furious | Location: Boston , MA |Question: Recently, I went away for one week to a group event with friends. Towards the end of the week, I connect with a guy who I have seen in my circle of friends. The last two days of the trip spent 24/7 with him. The attraction was instant, so we became intimate right away. After returning from our trip, we hung out everyday, 10 days straight. He instantly broke up with his girlfriend to be with me.Their relationship was coming to a close when we meet. Its been about six week since we met and the intensity is still the same, even thinking of going away for thanksgiving. Should I be concerned that everything is going quickly? He says I am his girlfriend. |Age: 40

If it seems too good to be true or seems too easy, it usually is.

The guy you’re speaking about is looking to get out of a relationship, and using you to do it. He’s convinced himself it’s that he’s swooning in love with you, and I’m sure to some degree he does care for you and like you. But he’s been staying in a dead end relationship for awhile now…so why leave now? Oh, that’s right. Because before he let go of one branch, he needed to find another to keep him from falling. It’s the timing that’s right for him, not necessarily the relationship itself. I’d slow things down if I were you before you get crushed.

I am cynical about high speed, broadband relationships.  Even more so when I hear about relationships that go from dating to engaged to married to getting pregnant in under two years. In my opinion, any man who moves this quickly does so for one reason..his biological clock was ticking.I don’t care how great a woman is or how ideal she might be….men spend their whole lives avoiding monogamy and commitment. I mean, they give in and do it, but we’re talking the end all, be all of monogamy – marriage. No guy is jumping in to that just because he thinks he met his dream woman. In fact, I don’t think the woman has nearly as much to do with it as his desire to start a family. I think when a man decides it’s time to have kids, it’s amazing how quickly he’ll find Ms. Right.

What’s “right” is the timing… for him. Same goes for the man in this letter. He was looking for an excuse to finally leave his GF, and this woman provided it. So he’ll tell himself, in order to avoid feeling like a jerk, that it was just fate or love at first sight or things with this relationship were just “right.” That’s why he finally put his girlfriend out of her misery. Yes, that’s it.  No, he’s not selfish for maintaining a relationship with his GF when he knew things were bad or on its last legs. No, not at all. (sarcasm)

Best of Moxie – How Much Effort Does a Man Need To Make?

Originally posted February, 2010 – 33 comments

Name: Sage | Location: Seattle , WA |Question: Hi Moxie,

I met a guy last weekend, and we hit it off. We have a lot in common, have similar backgrounds and had a great conversation (we talked for about an hour an a half).

He called the next day and asked me when I was free to go out. We made plans to see each other tonight (Friday night) at 10 pm because he had a work-related event that ended at 9 pm.

We met at 10 pm…everything went well. Great conversation, etc. After our drinks (one round) were done, he said, “I’m not sure I want to have another drink.” I said, “Well, I’ll let you decide while I use the restroom.” I come back to the table and the bill is paid. I say “thank you” for the drink and then he says, “Want to get out of here?” I agree, but I think that maybe he wants to go to another bar or lounge in the neighborhood (since it’s only 11 pm). But, the minute that we walk out of the restaurant, he says, “Well, do you want to do this again?” And I say, “Sure, I’d love to.” And then he asks ME to call him on Sunday night (I told him I have a girls’ dinner) so we can figure out a good time to get together during the week.

So here’s my gut instinct: He’s not into me. If he was, he would have wanted to stay out for longer than an hour, especially on a Friday night, and wouldn’t have asked ME to call him so we can figure out our next plans.

I’m thinking it was just lip service to be cordial, and I should probably not call him at all on Sunday night. At least then, if he calls, I’ll know that he’s really interested and wasn’t just being cordial. What do you think?  |Age: 33

You’ve already decided that this guy isn’t interested. Therefore everything you do, think and say from this point on will reflect that belief. Before you do call him on Sunday, and I highly suggest you do, you need to shrug off this feeling of doubt and insecurity. If he didn’t want to hear from you, then he would have taken ownership of the responsibility of following up. Think about it..if he didn’t want to see you again, why would he tell you to call him when that actually increases the chances that he’ll have to speak to you again?

Plus, why should he be expected to be the one to follow-up anyway? Why is it that we expect the guy to do the following up? Isn’t it enough that he asked you out the first time?

I understand why, in theory, you think his actions means he’s not interested. But right now you have no proof of anything. You’re just erring on the side of caution because you don’t want to feel like a fool. The worst that can happen is that you call him, he ignores your call and you never hear from him again. Do you really think he’ll pick up the phone if he’s already decided he’s not interested?

You’re closing yourself off instead of be open to the possibility that he is interested. You can look at it glass half full or glass half empty. It’s up to you.

ETA DECEMBER, 2010: I agree this guy is making a modest amount of effort. I would be equally miffed if some guy suggested that I call him to set up a second date.  What I wanted to communicate originally, and I’m not sure I did, was that we tend to measure other people’s interest in us by our own personal barometers. Sometimes that’s judgment call is accurate. Sometimes it’s not. There’s so much stuff that two people bring in to relationships – past experiences, individual belief systems, etc – that it’s impossible to be able to read their minds. Over thinking these points might prevent us from getting hurt or disappointed. But I think the over-analysis can hinder us just as often. I feel like this is the biggest hurdle that singles encounter. We take our expectations and code of dating ethics and project them on to our dates. We get stuck on the small stuff so often that we never get past the first lap. If the OP of this letter calls the man and he blows her off, how much damage could that do?  Would it do any more damage than if she never called him at all and she spent time wondering What If? Either way she’ll questions her choices.

I think a lot of people wish for or expect some sort of romantic comedy inspired first date. They want to meet cute, and have one of those dates where they talk for ever and feel totally comfortable, like they’ve known this person their whole lives. Sometimes first dates are awkward and short. If anything, I’m more suspicious of the longer dates than the shorter ones. What’s funny is that no matter how many times we go on those marathon dates, where everything is clicking and we get swept up in the moment and we end up in a crash and burn type relationships, we still prefer those dates to the shorter ones. Why? Because that’s what we see in TV and movies. We want romance and chemistry and intense attraction.

Love doesn’t always start out that way. Usually, at least in my experience, that never leads to real love at all. Infatuation, sure. Great sex? Absofuckinglutely.

But love? Committed, true, real love?  Not so much. Sometimes love starts out slowly. The upshot in those cases is that the heat last longer.  That’s the love you want. The kind where there’s a return on emotional and physical investment.

Just because it doesn’t look like a fantasy from the start doesn’t mean it won’t or can’t end up that way.

Best of Moxie – The Cost of Proposing

Originally Posted April, 2009 – 100 Comments

Name: Sticker Shocked | | Location: Washinton, DC , DC |Question: Hey Moxie-So my boyfriend of 4 years has made a few hints and he is shopping  for an engagement ring for me for my birthday.  He went online last night and he showed me a couple of different styles he was looking at.  He was on the hush, hush because he wanted to keep it as a surprise.  Well today I get this text message that said “I am still in sticker shock at how much the ring I want to get you cost…WOW”  I texted him back and said..how much is it and he texted back…the one he was looking at was $4,000.   Is it just me or would you get  your feelings hurt/pissed over that message.  I know 4K is a lot of money, I know that.  He did say that I was worth it and he would do what it took to get the ring for me but now I feel like the whole thing has gone sour.I thought his comment was tacky, there are so many women that would totally laugh at a 4K engagement ring, I don’t really care how much it cost but don’t bitch at me about it.  Thoughts??  Pissed or not pissed?  |Age: 30’s

He really did take the bloom off that rose, didn’t he? His comment about the price of the ring was inappropriate and a complete buzz kill. Was he trying to make you feel bad? I don’t think so. I think he was just being a bit clueless. Or he was intentionally trying to mislead you to maintain some element of surprise.

Maybe it’s me, but I’d want the whole thing to be a surprise. Yeah, that’s the 22-year-old in my that still hangs on to that fantasy of the romantic proposal. I guess that’s naive.

For all you know, he’s totally yanking your chain and bought you a different ring and is trying to throw you off. But when you get frustrated or upset about this situation, remember this. You have a guy that is pledging the rest of his life TO YOU. While lots of women might complain about a 4K price tag, there are just as many women who secretly wish they were in your shoes.

I’ve never been a big jewelery person. I do, however, relate to and understand the excitement over seeing that ring for the first time. To me, that ring represents a promise. It makes a statement of intent. It does not, however, inform me of my worth or my value. I really dislike this idea that a piece of jewelery is indicative of my contribution to a relationship or society. You can’t put a monetary value on that. Suggesting that a man buy you jewelery, or that you should buy it for yourself, so you can be reminded of how great you are or how much you “deserve it” really rubs me the wrong way. It reeks of entitlement. It also perpetuates this stereotype that women are all materialistic. Buy those items because you love them. Not to prove something to yourself or anyone else.

The greatest Christmas gift I ever received from a man was a $2.00 card he bought for me in the lobby of our building were we worked. To this day I have that card in a scrapbook of sorts next to old photos of us. Those are the items I go back to when I want to be reminded of what it feels like to be cared for and matter to someone. Not a necklace or a ring. I don’t need to be reminded of Marilyn Monroe or some other starlet or some sitcom character. I don’t want to be them. Know why? Because they were all either emotionally tortured or fictional.

 

 

 

 

Best of Moxie – Why Not Just Use a Post It to Dump Her?

Originally Posted Sept 10, 2009 – 48 Comments

Name: Curious Gentleman |  | Location: West New York , NJ |Question: Dear Moxie, I’d like to get your opinion on a technique I have for breaking up gently with women, and perhaps some of your female readers will contribute their opinions as well. I try to use this break-up technique whenever I’ve gone on a few dates with a woman over the course of 2 to 3 weeks or even if we’ve been seeing each other for up 2 or 3 months. The romantic relationships I build tend to be very close and friendly, but eventually I realize that while I like the woman, I don’t want to spend the rest of my life with her and it’s pointless to let the relationship continue.

However, I recognize that the woman probably has some attraction and attachment and I want to minimize how much she gets hurt, plus minimize the tears and any impact to her self-esteem and self-confidence.  So I’ll gently nudge the relationship in a direction where she gets the sense that while I’m a nice guy, I’m not the right man for her in the long term, and she eventually breaks up with me. She’s not angry and there are never any harsh words or hurt feelings, and the splits are always amicable.

By “nudge” I don’t mean that I become unkind or nasty. Some examples are becoming a little too blunt in everyday discussions; I might take a little too long to return a phone call or not be available for a date on a Saturday night. I realize this might seem manipulative, but I’ve found that by letting the woman end the relationship on her terms, she comes away feeling much better about herself. As far as I can tell, the women aren’t aware that I’m nudging our relationship to its conclusion.

I should add that I’m 44 years old, only date monogamously, have never cheated on a woman, and I’m usually on the receiving end of breakups even when I don’t use this technique. Fortunately, I’ve been dating my girlfriend for 14 months and we just moved in together. So I’m not planning a break up this time!

Was my novel technique too manipulative? Was this unfair to the woman? Would women have preferred that I end the relationship sooner in a gracious manner? Do other guys use this technique? The opinion of you and your readers is appreciated. |Age: 44

Looking back on this letter, I realized what originally irked me so much about it. This guy was so proud of himself for developing this “technique.” Passive Aggression is hardly new, brah. Oh, and as for this:

She’s not angry and there are never any harsh words or hurt feelings, and the splits are always amicable.

If there were no hurt feelings, then one might question whether there were any feelings to be hurt in the first place.

I understand why  men might use this approach. I do. Nobody likes tears or questions or drama. But, and I hate that I’m going to do this, to quote Sex & The City:

Billy : All I’m saying is that there’s no good way to break up with someone.

Carrie: Well, it’s funny you should mention that Billy, because, actually, there is. You can have the guts and the courtesy to tell a woman, to her face, that you no longer want to see her. Call me crazy but, I think that, you can make a point of ending your relationship in a manner that does not include an e-mail, a doorman, or a missing persons report. I think you could all get over your fear of looking like the bad guy and actually have the uncomfortable break-up conversation Because, here’s what; Avoiding that is what makes you the bad guy. And just so you know, Alan;

Andrew : Andrew..

Carrie : Uh huh. Most women aren’t angry, irrational psychos. We just want an ending to a relationship that… That is thoughtful and decent and honours what we had together. So my point, Billy, is this; There is a good way to break-up with someone, And it doesn’t include a post-it.

For every annoying quote about shoes and penis size, there really are some gems from SATC. Carrie said it best. There IS a way to end a relationship (meaning an ongoing and consistent scenario where multiple dates were involved) without playing some stupid game of cat and mouse. You simply tell her, honestly, how you feel.

I hate to break it to you, Gentleman, but I’m going to guess that at least 80% of the time those women will not break down and threaten to off themselves once they hear this news. Many of us have the courage and dignity to take the news, walk away and cry on our friend’s shoulders and not in public. Don’t pull a Jerry Maguire and plan to dump us in a crowded restaurant so as to avoid a scene. One, we know what you’re doing. Two, it’s completely unfair to put us in a situation where we’re forced to act in a certain way.  Nothing exacerbates frustration or hurt like feeling micro-managed or controlled.

For relationships of a couple of months or more, just set up a time to meet us and TELL US. Stop using the excuse that you are “afraid” of our emotions or how we’ll react. Just stop that already. That’s a lame excuse. Often times men know what the right and proper thing to do is. They’re just too scared to do it. Don’t pin the blame on us because you’ve lost your balls.

Again, like Carrie said, what hurts us in most of these early stage curb kicking isn’t the actual break up. It’s the manner is which we were thrown back in to the dating pool. The fade out is commonplace after one or two dates. The majority of us have accepted that. We don’t expect a phone call or telegram informing us that we weren’t chosen for the second round. Doesn’t mean we wouldn’t like it, but we don’t expect it. (This is another reason why first/second date sex is such a mistake. Having the guy say he’ll call after only to never hear from him again is humiliating. )

If you’ve gone out on three or more dates, and definitely if things have become physical, the decent and proper thing to do is to tell us to our face – phone, e-mail, whatever but NOT TEXT – that we won’t be seeing each other again. Just write it out if the thought of us weeping and threatening to pitch ourselves off a building is just too much for you. But say it. Whether she accepts it or not is not your responsibility. You don’t owe her more than you’ve given her, which should be an honest, sensitive explanation as to why things won’t be moving forward. Don’t feel the spark/connection you need? Say that. Not looking for a relationship at this point and don’t think you will be in the near future? Say that. (Better yet, don’t go on dates if that’s the case. YMMV on that one.) She very well might reply and ask for further explanation. Delete it. You said what you had to say. It’s her responsibility to deal with it.

But……..if you know she likes you and is interested in more and you know you’re not, then try to resist hitting the sheets or fooling around. Because if you hook up with us on date two or three or four or whatever knowing full well you don’t see long-term potential, then dump us a week or two later, then that is  going to make us feel used. That’s when we get angry.  Here’s where you need to be more responsible, guys. Stop using your testosterone as an excuse to be a  jerk.

This is why women need to get comfortable telling a guy that they’re not looking for a casual hook up if they’re seeking a relationship. Men will forge ahead regardless of what they know instinctively to be true and justify it by saying “she wanted it” or “she didn’t tell me that.” So tell them. Both people have to be responsible for their own feelings and emotions and expectations. You can’t expect someone else, someone who barely knows you, to care that much.

 

Why Did The Chicken Cross The Road? To Get Laid, of Course!

Name: Eve |  | Location: staffordshire , UK |Question: Not really a question, more of me asking your opinion.

What gives with these guys apart from labelling them as mentally ill?

For example.

Stage 1 Texts day & night, said he loved me after a couple of weeks.
Stage 2. I broke it off. I got back in touch, he then had a girlfriend he didn’t like much but we could have sex….hmmm.
Stage 3. I broke contact again-yeah I know, fool me once…
And now every few months I get the, Hi how are you doing texts?

Before someone asks, yes it was the same person I wrote about some while ago.  |Age: 36

 

I don’t understand what you mean. What gives? What gives is that this guy likely has and always had a girlfriend and was looking to get a piece on the side. Or he’s just one of the bazillion people out there who like to waste people’s time. Since you kept breaking contact, he figured out that your threats of cutting him off were empty. So when he feels the itch you’re someone (of likely a few) that he reaches out to.

I don’t think there’s a personality disorder of mental illness that explains this. A guy wants low maintenance sex so he turns to someone he thinks will go for it. You showed him, by contacting him multiple times, that you might be open to hooking up. You may have said you weren’t and even told him off. In cases like that, when a woman keeps coming back and coming back, despite little to no effort from the man, what they hear is “I’m not over you” or “I’m lonely/vulnerable.”

You know who this guy is. Yet you keep returning to the empty well. The question isn’t what’s up with him. It’s what’s up with you that you keep subjecting yourself to this?

Stop responding and cut off contact. Then throw away his number, delete it from your pone, block him on various sites, etc. Or just give in. You know you want to.What’s holding you back is this need you have for him to treat you differently so you can feel less bad about it.

Well, he’s not going to do that. And even if he does, it’s just to get you in to bed. So you can take what he offers at face value and accept it. Hell, you might even enjoy it. Temporarily of course. Or you can try and nudge him in to some sort of faux courting ritual. Either way you’re going to be on the receiving end of that Dear Jane letter where he tells you he’s met someone else, can’t keep doing this, this doesn’t work, etc. That is, if he even bothers to tell you he’s moved on.

He wants to get laid. So either give in or don’t. But definitely stop analyzing it. You’re trying to uncover a mystery that doesn’t exist. This is more along the lines of “Why did the chicken cross the road?” Why does he text you? To have sex with you.

Mystery solved.